Ep 27 - Corey Guy: Posting Jobs Isn't Recruiting (How to Find Top Talent in the Trades)

SPEAKER_01:American builders, hands that raise the dream One brick, one beam, building the American sea. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to another episode of American Builders. Today I am here with Corey Guy, owner and head recruiter of Ground Up Construction Recruiting. Corey, thank you for coming on the show. All right. Thanks for having me, Gear. Let's start with, you know, how we start most episodes. Just a quick background of your career, and then we'll dive into the specifics. We're going to start with some insurance talk, which is the world I come from and the world you originally came from. And then we'll get into the recruiting specifics. But just give the audience a little background on who you are.

SPEAKER_00:Yeah, man. Been out of the games for about five years now, but spent seven years in the insurance world, uh being a broker, commercial insurance, specializing in construction, mostly with general contractors, um, subcontractors, and developers. A little bit on the heavy civil side, but um didn't have a ton of that in the area, um, at least for clients to go after at the time. Um did that for five years in Nebraska and then two years in Arizona. And then my wife at the time, um, still is, but um, at the time, like when we moved to Arizona, she took a position as a travel occupational therapist, and I couldn't do the insurance gig anymore and kind of transitioned into recruiting, didn't even know it was an industry at the time, but saw, you know, from an outside perspective, her working with a healthcare recruiter.

And I was like, oh, there's gotta be like something in that for for construction.

SPEAKER_00:And um ended up, you know, getting on with the company and worked there for about a year and a half, and then we started our own thing about three and a half years ago.

SPEAKER_01:That's fantastic context for the episode here. Let's start with the insurance side. Obviously, you know, we come from the world, the exact same world, right? The general contractors, the subcontractors, we helped them manage the risk kind of throughout that chain of liability. But just talk to me about, you know, you had a big specialization in the space for a while. What were some of the common things you would see coming into specifically a general contracting business where you know you were able to kind of point some things out and add immediate value, if you will?

SPEAKER_00:Yeah, so I mean, there's a lot of things, you know, that contractors do right and a lot of things that contractors do wrong when it comes to insurance. You know, at the end of the day, they're builders, they're not insurance professionals, just like you know, anything else that you're selling into, you know, they're typically not the professional in that space you are. Um, but you know, they may have been involved in it for several years before you got involved in it. So, you know, they have a you know a sort of a knowledge base built up and then kind of get accustomed to that. Um, but some of the things, you know, learning along the ways of contractors, you know, some of the things that they did wrong is like having multiple brokers, you know, quote insurance every single year. Um, you know, in the public space in construction, they're used to low bid wins the project. So a lot of times

SPEAKER_00:they're looking for the lowest insurance quote to come in, and that's who they end up going with. Um, so you know, some of those things you kind of learn along the ways to educate the buyers on is you know, maybe that's not the best way to do it. You know, that's just what they're accustomed to and comfortable with, and that's what they know because they're in the construction space. But educating them on that aspect. But then, you know, it the some of the good things, you know, they're in construction day in and day out. They know the risks that they face. You know, us as insurance professionals, underwriters, brokers, account managers, stuff like that, we don't know the risks specifically that they see every single day on a job site.

So really being able to team up and you know, go out on job site visits, you know, getting in that specific world and understanding what they go through day

SPEAKER_00:in and day out and what they're facing that, you know, insurance professionals, you know, from an oversight, you know, we know what they deal with, but they really know you know the ins and outs and you know what they deal with from a risk standpoint, whether it be from the GC standpoint, the subcontractor standpoint, um, and really just being able to partner on those risks and get the best understanding when it comes to buying insurance and what makes most sense for them.

SPEAKER_01:And I'm sure that set up some great kind of context and understanding. Being able to go on those job sites and build those relationships for seven years probably created some great foundation for the business that you would eventually start. Before we get into that, I want to touch on kind of what our core competency is at TradeGuard, which is this compliance layer, whereas a GC, the people who actually create risk on a job site are all the subcontractors, right? They're doing the work. And, you know, the carriers, they don't necessarily like that sort of risk transfer and they don't understand how you're transferring the risk. What did you see in your experience with GCs in terms of, you know, what's the typical GC doing when it comes to making sure every sub's properly licensed, insured, vetted? And, you know, how what's the typical GC risk transfer look like?

And how do you think about

SPEAKER_01:improving it?

SPEAKER_00:Sure. Um I mean, this obviously isn't going to be for everyone, but a typical GC, you know, they're gonna have someone in like HR getting certificates of insurance um from each subcontractor that they work with, making sure that they're up to date, everything like that. But they don't specifically know, you know, that could always be, you know, a false document. That could be, you know, something that was, you know, two years old. They don't really know if it's up to date or you know, if it's proper insurance, what their, you know, um what the carrier left out of their insurance and what they're taking on that they don't actually know that they are taking on as a GC.

Um, you know, say from just like a general liability, general liability standpoint, um a carrier you know declines to offer them some specific insurance that the GC required and that they think they have, but you know, come down

SPEAKER_00:to it, they have a claim and that's gonna come on the GC. Um so a lot of time, you know, it's just someone in the company that doesn't deal with insurance every single day or is super up to date or knowledgeable on the subject. That's just one of their you know, 10 tasks that they have responsibility over. So sometimes it's just kind of like an oversight for them. So the GC can be taking on a lot more risk than they actually realize when it comes to working with subcontractors.

SPEAKER_01:That's exactly why we exist. I think you hit on that's something we talk about a lot in our conversations with customers is you've got somebody whose core sort of focus is not insurance, doing a very insurance and sort of risk-heavy scope of work. And without that understanding, there, like you said, you just leave a lot of room on the table for risk to come up, which is why you should put this in somebody's hands who actually understand the insurance world. So enough about my business. Let's get into yours. Um, for a GC who's kind of never used a recruiter, what does a firm like yours typically do for them? And just kind of provide an overview of your services and then we'll we'll get into the specifics.

SPEAKER_00:Yeah, a lot of the time, you know, when contractors are trying to recruit people, they'll they'll post a job and wait for people to apply and you know, they'll skim through the resumes and pick out maybe a couple and interview those people. Maybe they're hitting 10%, 20% of the market at best when it comes to you know getting the best applicants possible for their job. So they're leaving a ton on the table when it comes to just that aspect. But you know, when we work with a company, maybe we'll post a job. Every once in a while we'll get a good candidate that applies to it and we'll screen them and take them through the interview process and get them hired. Um, but most of the time, you know, it really comes down to the headhunting piece of it. So say a company hires us to help them hire a superintendent.

Um, first things first, you know, we're gonna meet with a client, you know, really learn

SPEAKER_00:the ins and outs of their business. That way, when we're reaching out to candidates, it's as if they're talking to someone internally. That's how well we want to know their company. Um, you know, when we get accustomed with the client's business, we're gonna go out, say, for example, you know, we're gonna go out source a hundred superintendents that we think would fit based on experience-wise, the types of projects that they've worked on, um, geography, um, how long they've been in the industry, you know, things like that. Maybe we've talked to some of these candidates before, maybe we haven't. Um, so when we start doing that, we'll start doing outreach, cold calls, emails, checks, LinkedIn DMs, um, referrals, every way that we can possibly get in touch with these people. We want to reach as many of them as possible.

Tell them about the opportunity to get to know them a little bit better,

SPEAKER_00:um, see if this might be a good career jump for them, you know, whether it be in um, you know, better benefits, increase in pay, better growth potential. Um, they're looking for a particular type of culture to be a part of. What they're currently at isn't you know mixing up with their vibes the best. Um, really, it could be a whole gamut of areas of what they're looking for and why that potential opportunity could be a good fit for them. Um but then once we get candidates interested in that position, that company, we'll screen them further to make sure that they're hitting all the key things that we're looking for that this client wants in this person. We're gonna screen for all those particular things. And then once they kind of, you know, we get a good feel for them, we think they'd be a good fit for the company.

We'll then turn them over to the client, manage that process, get interviews

SPEAKER_00:set up and everything, and make sure that they're hiring the best person for the job.

SPEAKER_01:It's kind of similar to what we were talking about with the insurance side is you know, if you're a smaller shop or even if you're a bigger shop and it's you've got somebody who maybe it's the HR manager and they're not hiring all the time, they're handling sort of the day-to-day, and it's such an important thing, which highlights why it's so important to bring in somebody who specializes this and focuses on it. So just kind of a thread there that's similar. It's like it when you have these core things that need to be done right, look for the experts in the industry. But let's talk about sort of starting the business. You you started with your wife, correct? You guys are running it together. Talk me, talk me through that. What was the process like of kind of this? Like when did you decide to that this is the step you want to take?

Um, and especially when you decided it's you know a step you

SPEAKER_01:want to take together and work together.

SPEAKER_00:Yeah, so um when I got into the industry, worked for a company for about a year and a half, learned the ins and outs of the industry, um, and then got to a point where we just felt comfortable, you know, taking on the risk of starting a business ourselves. And we wanted to, you know, work together. We wanted to start a business together and create something like that, man. Um, and just work side by side. And so we started branding ourselves as a husband-wife construction recruiting team. We don't have any employees, it's just us two. Um, there's a couple other companies out there that you know have a similar model like us, uh, but there's not a ton in industry. So we're kind of specialized in that specific area. Um, you know, there's less overhead, clients are directly dealing with just us two. There's not, you know, people under us or over us.

And you know, when they work with ground up,

SPEAKER_00:they're working directly with the two owners, which is really cool. Um, just got to a point where it's like, let's do this, let's let's take this risk, let's go out on our own, let's try it. Um you know, we didn't, you know, have we have a daughter out, but we didn't have any kids at the time, and it just made sense right then. Um in there, it's like, let's go do it, let's try it out. And man, God has just blessed us. It's it's been an amazing three and a half years now, and um have worked with you know over 30 general contractors, um, a lot in the Midwest, West Coast. Um yeah, we've helped a lot of people hire really good people. So it's it's been a great road so far.

SPEAKER_01:I think a key part of helping people hire really great people is the culture. You've mentioned that um kind of a few times now. Talk to that a little bit. You know, if you go to your site, there's there's all sorts of different copy there about how culture and in identifying the culture of the GC and making sure it fits with the person they're looking to hire, how important that is. Walk me through how you come in and kind of evaluate a culture or you know, what do you think a culture means uh in a business?

SPEAKER_00:Yeah, so this is a big like key that not only we look for when we're hiring, but companies um want when they're hiring individuals. So everyone has their own personality, man. So and every company kind of has a personality too. When you get a bunch of people together, um, you can really see it kind of what that culture feels like. Um a lot of the companies that we work with are faith-based. Um, we are as well. So when it comes to culture like that, you know, um people are looking for someone with, you know, a similar type of um life outlook, stuff like that. So looking for people that jive really well together. Um and man, culture, culture can mean so many different things for for different companies. A lot of companies don't know what their culture is, but you know, it can start with their mission, their vision, their values. And that's a lot of the times what we start to base it off of

SPEAKER_00:is really get down to the nitty-gritty of, you know, what makes you guys tick? Why are you doing this? And go out and find in those individuals that share that same passion, you know, that same drive. Um, some people just want to show up, get a paycheck, go home. Some people are very entrepreneurial, um, you know, want to kind of be in the uh risk-taking aspect of the business, see the ins and outs of how a business runs, um, want to be there after just a nine to five and really understand how a business works. Um, so that can be a part of a culture too, as someone that has, you know, a company that has a lot of drive, um, wants to grow, um looking for those types of individuals that are always looking to um, you know, outperform their you know, their peers get better, always um get better personally, things like that. So culture can mean a lot of things. Uh, like I said, means different

SPEAKER_00:things to different companies, but really trying to understand um what it means to each company and finding those individuals that fit.

SPEAKER_01:I think that you mentioned something there. It's you know, a lot of people might not know what their culture is. And I think you provide a great service there in that when you come in, helping them define what the culture is through, you know, a series of questions and helping them kind of formulate that, you know, it's probably helpful for them, one, to understand how they want to lead their business. But obviously the biggest part that you help with is helping that culture attract people with similar cultures. You know, if you're wandering around sort of aimlessly and haven't defined that, it's hard to uh it makes your decision making a little bit easier when you're going through that process of who to hire.

What do you see as kind of like what are the attributes of a bad culture, if you will, um, that you kind of try to help either, you know, not focus on if you're hiring people or help

SPEAKER_01:them get through? Like what makes a bad culture that you see often?

SPEAKER_00:Yeah, so culture, you know, typically starts from the top and goes to the bottom. So you can quickly find out in a lot of our initial discussions with companies that we might end up working with, we can quickly tell from a first conversation what a kind of a culture feels like just from talking with an owner or an executive of a company and kind of the things they're talking about, their personality, how they answer particular questions, um, how they treat their people is a big, big aspect of it. Um, and just kind of how how they talk online as well. Um, and then some some red flags is like when we have those discussions, is how they talk about their people. Are they talking about them good? Are they saying bad things about them? Um, are they overworking their employees? Do they provide good benefits? Do they not provide any benefits at all?

That can kind of be a good indicator of like how

SPEAKER_00:they value their team members. Um they really investing in their team, do they care about their futures? Do they care about their families? Or are they just there to get work done? And um, you know, some of the questions kind of leading up to that is like, you know, what's your retention been like over the past six to twelve months? If we get a bad feel for that, you know, the owner keeps saying, Oh, people keep leaving, you know, they end up leaving here for six months and move on. That's kind of a big red flag to us. It's like, okay, let's dig into that a little bit deeper. Why are these people leaving? Is it due to the company? Is it culture, how they're being treated? You know, um, are they getting not paid enough? You know, what what's going on here? Um, so if we get any kind of indicators of you know that, we try to dig in as deep as possible to really understand if this is this on

SPEAKER_00:the company or is this just from like an individual standpoint? Um, and really trying to ask follow-up questions um to figure out kind of what what the culture is like there.

SPEAKER_01:You mentioned pay, and I think that's that's a hard part of no matter what business you're in, figuring out, you know, what do you pay people? How do you how do you start helping general contractors or any construction business when it, you know, when they're looking to hire somebody, how do you help them figure out what to actually pay these people? Is it data sources that you're pulling from? How do you think about structuring the pay?

SPEAKER_00:We've used some data sources, but they don't really show you know what the market is truly paying. And that could change so quickly over the past six months. Um we use a lot of our own market research. So I mentioned we work with a ton of clients in the Midwest. Um, so when a company comes to us and we start working with a new client, odds are we're working with their some of their competitors too. So we know exactly what they're paying. You know, we've talked to hundreds or thousands of candidates in this market. We know what they're paying, we know what their expectations are. So a lot of it comes from just you know talking to clients, prospects, candidates, and really understanding, you know, firsthand what they're getting paid. Sure, we'll look on, you know, say LinkedIn, for example, and see what other companies are offering on their job posts and whatnot, and comparing it.

But a lot

SPEAKER_00:of it just comes through the research that we've done.

SPEAKER_01:And then benefits, I think, is another aspect of it, right? You've got, you know, what is the the pay, but what are the benefits? I think benefits and construction is a super interesting topic because not everybody knows how to approach that. How do you go about approaching that, advising on how much benefits to include, what type of roles to include it for, and all of that.

SPEAKER_00:Yeah, every company is different as far as how they go about and how much benefits they offer, but you know, pretty much across the board, companies are offering medical, dental, vision insurance and paying some sort of percentage on that, between like 50 to 100%. Um some companies will even pay 100% of employee and dependents. It's pretty, you know, seldom that we we come across that. Usually if they're paying 100%, it's just for the employee, and then the employee has to pay a certain percentage for their dependents. Um, but you know, medical dental vision insurance, that's pretty standard across the board. Um a 401k or an IRA, depending on the size of the company. Um, that's typically always provided. Usually the best companies are offering between like a three to five percent match on that.

Um, bonuses, most construction companies are are standard across the board on this, usually like

SPEAKER_00:a 10% bonus, a discretionary bonus, depending on you know the profitability of the company, um, how you perform it as an individual. Um, and that's 10% of your yearly salary. Some companies are a little bit better than that, pay out like on a quarterly basis and have specific like KPIs per position based on that. Um, but a lot of it is just like 10%, and a lot of candidates end up getting burned on that too. Um, so that's like a big discussion in the industry as well. It's like, okay, how are these bonuses specifically paid out? The candidate wants to know because they've been burned so many times in the past of like, oh, this is a you know a discretionary bonus. You know, some companies will put it in writing, some won't, but then they're like, ah, a bonus is a bonus. I don't know if I'll get this or not. So um company truck or uh a vehicle allowance is um is a good benefit to have.

Most

SPEAKER_00:companies are paying between like 400 to 800 dollars per month for a vehicle allowance with a gas card or providing a company truck. Um those are all from like a benefit standpoint, very standard in the construction industry from a general contractor stand uh point, from for like superintendents, project managers, some estimators will even get a company truck or a vehicle allowance, um project engineers, you know, stuff like that. Um some other perks, and like that kind of like makes the the culture culture too. It's like some companies are starting to build um you know pickleball courts or gyms at the office and letting employees use that whenever they want. Um, that's a really cool perk, a great selling point. For some employees, that you know that that's what they're into.

Um you know, some people will, you know, this is this isn't like a huge thing, but everyone uh will offer like two

SPEAKER_00:to three weeks PTO to start off with. You know, when someone's offering like four weeks, that's like a huge, huge selling point. Um, and then there's just like little things here and there, like perks that companies can offer that makes themselves a little bit different from others.

SPEAKER_01:You guys have uh kind of a great structure for different packages that you offer. There's kind of the the foundation, the framing, and then the topping out packages. Walk me through those and kind of what each one entails um and just kind of how you think about those different career stages when it comes to how do you approach each one differently.

SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Um, so we just wanted to use like some construction words to um help contractors really identify what our packages mean for the most part. So, like foundation, you know, concrete underground utilities, that's when we're talking like entry-level positions. And for us, that's like project engineer, assistant superintendent, assistant, project manager, those types of levels. Um, so really getting in at the ground floor of a company. Um, that's really where we start. Every once in a while, we'll help a company hire like a foreman, but that's really like the lowest we'll go. We don't do anything on the labor or skilled labor side. Um, with that package, you know, that's our, you know, you could say like the most cost-effective package. You know, with that, you know, you get a certain guarantee period. Um, and then it's the the lowest fee that we charge.

Most companies are charging a percentage

SPEAKER_00:fee based on the first year's salary. Um, we do everything on a flat fee basis. Um, so you know exactly going into it what you're gonna pay us, whether you pay this person 100K or 200K, you know, you pay us this flat fee and you know exactly what you're gonna pay us going into it. Framing is what we call kind of that that mid-range um professional, PMs, superintendents, estimators, pre-con managers. Um, that's really our mid-range with that. You know, you get a higher guarantee period. Um, it's a more challenging um search for us, so we charge a little bit more of a fee. And then the topping out phase, um, that's more like senior level through executive. That's the highest guarantee period, the hardest type of search for us, the most time consuming, the most resources, everything like that that goes into it.

Um, but yeah, that's kind of like three um structures that we offer as far as like

SPEAKER_00:what level of profession are you trying to hire?

SPEAKER_01:I'm curious about the kind of the executive level searches. What is your, you know, what is the typical process for that look like? And you know, are you looking at, you know, they currently have a role and you're trying to kind of offer this as a new option? The that one, like you said, it seems like the hardest one to fill, but oftentimes the most important. So how do you typically kind of start that process if you get somebody who wants to do the topping out or that executive level recruit?

SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Um when it comes down to it, it's a it's a pretty similar search to the rest of them. Um, but there's a lot less people to go after. Um, you know, most executives are in a good spot with their company. They're not, you know, looking to make a move. They're not actively on the market looking around. So it really takes you know a good brand, a great company for them to want to even consider having a conversation. If they don't know who this company is, if they don't know, you know, if they haven't been in the market for a while, they're not really interested. They won't even take a call. They really want to join organizations that have been around for a long time or have you know a lot of opportunity for them.

Um so it comes down to a lot more conversations on our end, a lot more trying to get referrals into people, um, really understanding what their needs are, why they would be interested

SPEAKER_00:in the position, selling them further on an opportunity. Um, how this could compare different from like a to like an entry-level project engineer position, you know, PE's coming right out of college. Um, you know, they're they might be more apt to look for a different opportunity quickly. You know, they're just looking for the next best thing a lot of the times. Executives, you know, they're they're proven, they know what's going on in the industry, they know what they truly want next in the career. Um so, you know, really being able to sell them on the opportunity, screening them further, checking references. Um, you know, some of those interview processes will require more um time with the client too, dinners, maybe golf, stuff like that. So really understanding the professional a lot more and making sure it's the right fit for them, that they're just not looking for more pay and stuff

SPEAKER_00:like that.

SPEAKER_01:Now I want to kind of dig into to each one of them in terms of what you look for uh to make a good hire. So starting at that foundational level, what are some of the attributes that you're trying to make sure are in place and some of the boxes that you're checking, you know, to make it even a consideration to bring somebody in?

SPEAKER_00:Yeah, for more like the entry-level um position or looking for someone that has drive, wants to grow, is loyal, um, is gonna work hard. Um, kind of those things that a company looks for right away in uh you know an entry-level position is someone that wants to stay with the company for long term, grow into more of that you know, project manager, superintendent level to be able to really lead a project. Um, someone that's you know entrepreneurial doesn't always have to be told what to do, uh, but is a good listener and you know is gonna you know take what they're told, take what they learned and really go apply it quickly.

SPEAKER_01:And I think the you know, those are attributes that often aren't on a resume, right? You gotta kind of you have to kind of dig those out of the person through the the discovery phase, if you will. Um and then on the framing side, kind of that next level up, like what's what kind of experience are you looking for there? And again, any attributes that you know aren't typically just on a resume that you're looking for?

SPEAKER_00:Yeah, so like a mid-level search, um, these are like some of my favorite ones too, because they have the experience. Um, they've built you know several projects, they've led teams before, ensure they have the experience. Um they've been in the industry long enough, but do they have those soft skills? You know, are they a good communicator? Um, how do they present themselves? You know, stuff along those lines of when we're doing these screening calls, it's really easy to you know understand is this um person able to get along with the executive team? Are they going to work along well with others? Um, so really having those conversations and seeing if they have the soft skills that's needed in this mid-level type of position that can grow into more of a senior level role. That's what we're really looking for in terms of those.

SPEAKER_01:And then the the C-suite, if you will, what are some things that, I mean, is there anything that comes to mind that people typically get wrong or common mistakes that get made? Because that's such a high stakes hire if you're bringing in, you know, a CEO, a COO. What are what are some things that you've seen gone wrong in that process where they bring them in and a couple months later they realize, okay, this might not have been the right decision. Now we now we got to reach out to Corey.

SPEAKER_00:Yeah. I'd say one of the biggest ones with when it comes to like an executive is hiring like one of their friends outside of the industry. Um, we I've seen this go wrong multiple times. If like say you're hiring someone for an executive level position that still needs to have a really good understanding of construction, um, that can turn people off internally because they're now reporting to someone that has no clue, you know, what processes, procedures are in their company, you know, you know, what construction is at all. So hiring someone from outside the industry for a very high-level role like that can be a turnoff internally. Um, and then when they get into the role, you know, they don't know how to talk to these individuals. They don't know what's going on, they don't know how to um, you know, even you know, read blueprints or plans, anything like that.

So having a general understanding

SPEAKER_00:of construction is key for sure in these high-level roles and hiring outside of the industry um typically doesn't go the best.

SPEAKER_01:Yeah, there's there's this, you know, the whole trend of buy boring businesses or you know, buying trades businesses that is super popular online. I think that's a big problem that a lot of people probably face when they get into a business. You know, you coming from a finance world and now you just bought a plumbing company or or what whatever the case may be. And that definitely probably creates a little bit of friction when you like you said, you don't necessarily understand the terminology quite like you might you might should. The uh you mentioned you kind of aren't focused much on the the skilled labor, but I am curious to hear your thoughts on, you know, we're constantly hearing about this labor shortage, a lot, especially you know, with the the data center boom and all the labor that's needed. Have you seen this come up in in your conversations with customers?

What are your thoughts

SPEAKER_01:on this this labor shortage?

SPEAKER_00:Yeah, man, all the time. Everyone, and it's been like that, you know, since I started in insurance. Um, it's always a topic of discussion. Um I think what it really comes down to is like companies not taking ownership of attracting um, you know, young the younger generation. They think they should just come to them um and be ready to work. You know, it's not like what it was in the old days. You know, people in newer generations have so many more options than what people used to have. So construction isn't always, you know, on their radar of an option for them, even or something that they would want to consider. So we need to do a really, you know, we need to do a better job as an industry, but companies individually as well need to know how to market to the younger generation to really get them interested. Um a lot of companies, you know, aren't don't even have an online presence.

They have

SPEAKER_00:an outdated website from 20, 30, 40 years ago that they don't even put updated projects on. You know, if you really want to attract you know younger people, you gotta be on social media, you gotta be, you know, posting on Instagram, TikTok, LinkedIn, everything like that, um, talking about your company, talking about construction, you know, just the industry as a whole, why it's such a you know fun industry to be a part of, so much opportunity. Um, and you know, showing, sharing videos of what's going on on your sites and just you know, showing you know all the cool stuff that entails construction and why it would be a good industry and such a good opportunity for younger people to be a part of right now, especially with so many people retiring uh right now. There is a need for a lot of people and so much opportunity to be had.

So um helping them understand, you know, yeah, you might be a

SPEAKER_00:laborer for a little bit, or you might, you know, have you have your tool belt on for you know the first few years, but then you can rise through the ranks, you can manage projects, you can lead teams, you know, you can go start your own company one day. Um, there's so much good opportunity right now in the construction industry, and companies really need to understand that and do something about it and take ownership of that problem to really get the next generation um interested and make themselves aware um in the market as well.

SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I saw you posted uh something similar to what you were just talking about there about the importance of social media, obviously from a marketing perspective and just you know, sales and acqu acquisition on that front, it's important, but definitely important on the recruiting side as well. Have you worked with any companies that have kind of leaned into that a little bit and seen some good results? Or is this mostly just advice where you're, you know, a gap in the market that you're seeing?

SPEAKER_00:Yeah, there's definitely a big gap. Um, you know, some some of our clients they have a good social media presence, some of them don't. But you know, if they do have a good social media presence, they're known in the market when say they choose to work with us or they do recruiting on them themselves. You know, when they reach out to Ken, it's a lot, it's a lot easier for them to you know get someone on a call or uh be willing to take an interview because they already know who they are. They've seen their videos, they've you know seen the owner of the company talk, they they know some of their people just because they've seen videos of them or they've seen pictures, um, they know their branding around town, they know what they stand for, their values, their mission, what they're all about.

Um, so when you have that social media presence, when you have that brand awareness, you know, candidates

SPEAKER_00:are gonna be reaching out to you. You're not gonna be the one that's always having to go out to the market and do everything you can to attract um companies from that standpoint. People are gonna be wanting to come work for you. You're not gonna have to sell yourself as much because they already know who you are.

SPEAKER_01:I think that there's almost could be like two buckets of sort of marketing content that you put out, right? Like, yes, you have content for customers and prospects, but you know, if you being intentional about marketing to the younger audience, there's a bit of a difference in the actual content that's there, right? Like talking about different things for specifically hiring and attracting the kind of talent you want.

SPEAKER_00:Yeah, definitely.

SPEAKER_01:Corey, this has been a great conversation. Where can people find you? And then kind of who specifically do you want reaching it out? Whether it's you know the type of customers or the people at the businesses, uh, where can they find you and who do you want reaching out?

SPEAKER_00:Yeah, man, you can find you know me and our company on LinkedIn. We're very active on that platform. Um, you know, a lot of our clients are our general contractors between like 20 million to 100 million in revenue. Um, we're typically working directly with the owners and executives of the company. Um, but happy to you know talk with anyone if if you're early in your career, you know, middle of career, late in your career. Happy to have conversations, um, whether if you're just you know curious about the market or if you're interested in making a move, always happy to chat me in.

SPEAKER_01:Awesome. Thank you so much, Corey. Awesome. Appreciate it, Gary.